Cornish Constitutional Convention-10th Anniversary-July 24th

[carrek]

I'm not 100% Marhak but I reckon the Redruth school (the one near Tesco) has had an English flag in it's sign since before Lavery, I remember being when seeing it.

On another note as the Council parking charges are going up, I guess the signs will need changing, might be good to add some Cornish Language to the signs at the same time if pos

According to the school's website, the Redruth School uniform has the lamb logo that is also found on Redruth's bins, with English flag. But strangely the school's prospectus has the flag with a black cross.

Marhak, didn't you once say that the original design these logos are based on wasn't coloured? Or that it was coloured, but was a flag with something to do with tin, not the English flag? Perhaps Redruth School were contacted and corrected their logo but for practical reasons can't correct everyone's uniform...

Although I was in Redruth the other day and saw that one of the bins had the red cross painted black, but not others. Not that I usually spend much time looking at bins...

[Marhak]

It was a stamp embossed into tin ingots, so had no colour. However, it was devised in Cornwall for Cornish tin, so the Cornish flag was almost certainly in the mind of the designer who, if I recall correctly, was one of the Daubuz family. It would hardly have been the English one, and woud bear out the words of Davies Gilbert who described Baner Peran as the tinners' flag. At least the Lamb and Flag pub at Canonstown (right next to the Roseangrouse Smelting House) changed its sign from the Butcher's Apron to the Gwynn ha Du (which caused to me to rewrite the chapter "The Power of Doctor John Dee" on p107 of "The Tinners' Way" - originally the two lads from Angarrack were caught up a ladder altering the pub sign - then the pub itself changed it in real life, so I had to rewrite to be an argument over rights of way. Thank God I spotted the welcome change in time!).

[Kerrow]

The full webcast of the event is here:

http://www.cornwall.public-i.tv/site/pl ... sh&l=en_GB

and Alec Robinsosn's piece is here:

http://www.cornwall.gov.uk/default.aspx?page=24718

Lavery starts talking about 49 mins in. He says the opportunity that now exists for devolving powers to Cornwall will last for 12-18 months, and he says that devolution is key to being able to meet the required spending cuts.

[nick00]

shaz this is a brand new sign saw it today also noticed some on the litter bins aswell but i can tell you this it won,t be a english flag by end of the week if it,s not changed the cans and stickers will come out i hope laverys got a big budget for cover ups of graffiti its out of my hands.

[Marhak]

Yes, Mike - we found an "English" Heritage site mentioning the Roseangrouse Smelting House - which claimed that the cross of the lamb and flag was that of St George. Between us, the Celtic League and I sorted that out and got them to change it.

[Zennorman]

Bloody stupid that devolution should be the key to making spending cuts. There will see be a further 2000 people and their families on the dole, plus the knok on effect. How popular will a Cornish assembly be as a 'commisioning body', employing a lot less people and contracting companies from outside of Cornwall if they offer 'better value for money'? About as popular as a fart in a space suit.

We should make sure that we get a Cornish assembly on our terms, not heavy terms with consequences.

[Kerrow]

Calm yourself Zennorman.

Admittedly that was my take on what was said, but cuts in spending would seem to be unavoidable in the near future, and if a Cornwall Investment Fund and devolved powers to Cornwall result from the forthcoming situation then that would clearly be a case of turning events to advantage.

How popular will a Cornish assembly be as a 'commisioning body', employing a lot less people and contracting companies from outside of Cornwall if they offer 'better value for money'?

A Cornish Assembly won't happen until the results of the cuts are well forgotten. However, effectively delivering spending cuts will be a lot easier for Cornwall to do if it can make more decisions itself. And easier means less painful all round, from individual members of Cornish society to the heart of central government.

Kevin Lavery's presentation ( which finishes with the phrase "We don't need to ask permission") to Cornwall's business leaders on Thursday is informative about the emerging determination to get a new approach to devolution and local government and can be found at the bottom of this page as 'The latest position of Local Enterprise Partnerships':

http://www.cornwall.gov.uk/default.aspx?page=24697

[Zennorman]

Balderdash. Spending cuts on this scale to these things are not needed. Government is cuting the wrong things or not raising revenue in the right way and this is having a knock on effect on Cornwall Council. You seem to be suggesting that people and and the people who rely on the Council (contractors etc) should pay with their jobs for suppot an investment fund that, my goodness, will have immediate an early pulls on it. As far as I can see f**k all is beng done to deal with the consequences of cuts either locally or natioanlly. Realistically, is isn't Cornwall making these decisions now.

A Cornish assembly it looks to me will be the fall guy for all of this and those desperate for it are in danger of waning it at any price. The reason the Condems suddenly believe in devolution is so that someone else can get the blame. Cuts will not be 'well forgotten'. What is happening to Cornwall and the country has the real threat and danger of setting us all back 60 years. Remember, we only paid off the national debt accuumlated in WW2 in 2000; now we are back in the same bloody position as we were and the country and Cornwall's infrastructure weren't that great before anyway.

[GrahamHart]

Spending cuts, spending cuts.....and then I read in this weeks West Briton that there will be £8 Million spent on refurbishments to their snug little nest in Truro.

When will you ever learn. Listen to George.

[Zennorman]

Right on Graham. The unitary would have worked had not the economy collapsed and the Council could not sell off its surplus properties, but then you think if they want to get all those people in county hall they wont have to worry about it if they are going to sack loads so why do they need to spend the £8m. What is more sickening is the big pay offs that ex senior staff get. lump sumps of £100k and pensions of £30k a year are not unknown.

[Kerrow]

The points you make Zennorman are fair, and it depends whether you think Cornwall is best suited to a larger or a smaller public sector. In my opinion, Cornish innovation and independence that has been honed and developed by over a millennium of mining with its egalitarian and expansionary framework is better suited to an environment where the private sector can flourish and and the public sector is less invasive than currently.

As far as the Investment Fund is concerned, it is a novel and somewhat shocking idea. However, if £30m can, through match funding and other means be turned into £360m to potentially be invested as Cornwall chooses, and if it is able to act as an incentive to get through a difficult economic time then it does inject positive thinking into a negative situation.

With regard to devolution, I think your argument contradicts itself. 'The reason the Condems suddenly believe in devolution is so that someone else can get the blame.' Are you suggesting the Council should say – “Central government should make the decisions about how to run Cornwall over the next four years. We are asking Westminster and Whitehall more than ever to tell us what they think should be done.” ?

[Zennorman]

Kerow. I realise that the levels of state spending are unsustainble but change like this has to be planned. Lavery and others appear to have to no strategy for the consequences of job losses. Change on this scale will also do immense damage to the private sector and, overall, damage Cornwall's competitiveness and progress that it has made over the last 10 or 15 years.

The Conservtives have never been in favour of devolution and always had this quaint notion of the 'union'. However, because UKplc is all but bankrupt if you shift responsibility to communiies you cab theoretically get things done for next to nothing. The Liberals have promised a Cornish assembly for years (which incldentally lets not get carried away is still not on the table) and never delivered. Also, in Cornwall during the election their literature implored voters to vote for them to save public sector jobs from the Tories.

Liars.

[Kerrow]

Cornwall is better prepared than most places to deal with job cuts as so much of Convergence funding is about re-training and increasing skills. For example, there is:
Outset Cornwall http://www.outsetcornwall.co.uk/
newworkcornwall http://twitter.com/newworkcornwall
Creative skills http://www.creativeskills.org.uk/your-creative-business
etc

And who cares a jot about what the Tories or the Lib Dems feel about the devolution of decision-making powers to Cornwall? It is for Cornwall to be clear in telling them what we want. At last those in political charge in Cornwall are beginning to say this.

[Zennorman]

Its pretty pointless starting your own business when other businesses will be going down the pan because of cuts inb state spending. Kerow, this is cloud cookoo land.